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Home >> Technical >> Replacing the mast collar
Bringing this thread up to date;

I understand that the latest bonding solution used there is Epoxy resin, with Gorilla Glue Epoxy working well, and that all new masts from RS in 2021 are Epoxy bonded.




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19/04/2021 23:22:00
Peter Barton
Posts: 4676
I've done one with sikaflex (the old version) and two with araldite (the new version). All are holding.

Just need to be thorough with the prep.



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04/03/2021 18:57:00
Hairsy
Posts: 44
The Sikaflex TechGrip is holding well.


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04/03/2021 15:09:00
Tijuana Taxi
Posts: 19
My turn to revive this thread-- to the people that have done a repair with the standard kit, has it held? Or do you suggest using a different glue from what's supplied?


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04/03/2021 13:03:00
Julius
Posts: 15
I'm about to reattach the collar on my 9 (3rd time). This time I'm going to use Sikabond, TechGrip, a polyurethane high strength adhesive, waterproof too. Shall let everyone know how it goes. TT


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24/08/2020 07:19:00
Tijuana Taxi
Posts: 19
My mast collar adhesive just failed on my 9 mast in about 12 knots of wind.  I purchased the 9 (sail & mast) after market in 2018. 
 
The collar has ribs, so I think it is the new design. Checking around the boat park in Seattle, this failure rate seems to match what others are seeing (18 to 24 months of club sailing), even after repairs with the kit (AER-UA-603).  Upon removal of my collar, there was no adhesive stuck on the inner ribs or in the grooves between the ribs.  There was minimal adhesive on the mast under the collar, and quite a bit above and below the collar.  My collar and mast looked like those in the photos earlier in this thread.
 
I am trying to figure out whether this was just an improper installation (not enough adhesive between collar and mast) or whether Sikaflex 291 simply will not stick to the plastic collar. Has anyone tried an adhesive other than Sikaflex 291?  I used E6000 from Goop and will see how it goes.
 
Here is another idea.  Since the fwd edge of the collar is never loaded, how about making a vertical cut down the fwd edge, like the RS Feva (FEV-SP-913).  The Feva uses a rivet and this would not be good on an Aero mast.  Having the cutout would allow easier installation and better distribution of adhesive between the collar and mast. 



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20/08/2020 23:34:00
MJohns77
Posts: 5
This is what I did.  Whether you choose to follow it is up to you.
 
- Carefully drill out to the retaining rivet for the plastic mast base plug (some people might have a retaining screw?)
- carefully tap out the plastic mast base plug, working around with a very large flat e.g. screwdriver at 120 degree rotation so as not to cam the plug in the mast, be patient and don't strike the mast itself lest you damage it;
- thoroughly clean all mating surfaces of inside of collar and mast where collar is to be glued.  Use wire brush/60 grit sandpaper (go lightly) & then remove any grease with a rag with acetone;
- cut additional horizontal slots inside the collar using a Dremel tool cutting wheel (I used two wheels doubled together, and made a nice pattern, partly because I like patterns, and also to avoid lining up any of my slots next to other lest I create a stress fracture pattern.  If you don't have a Dremel tool or but a cheap equivalent, ask a friend, or a even maybe a local model maker or jeweller, or choose to skip this step completely as possible overkill);
- lightly keyed the inside of the collar, including the recessed rims with 60 grit sandpaper;
- removed loose burrs with a wire brush; and
- cleaned again.
 NOTE: If you've left the mast collar loose and rotating for too long, you might have worn away the inner surface and need to purchase a new replacement collar so that the collar is a tight and not a floppy fit which will be difficult to centre on the mast (I tried that once, it's not worth the effort).
 
To re-attach, I've:
- Made sure to work out the collar location beforehand, by sitting the mast in the mast step, allowing also for the height of the mast base plug; 
- covered the mast etc (including outside of collar) in masking tape, everywhere you don't want Sikaflex to go, remember masking tape is cheap. Don't forget to leave bare the mast substrate where you tapered rims of Sikaflex will be;
- done a test "dry" fit to make sure the collar will slide over the masking tape, and be double certain where the final position will be (remember, there will be black Sikaflex obscuring any pencil marks, so better have an external reference like a notched stick handy);
- put several layers of disposable gloves on my hands, since I tend to get glue like Sikaflex everywhere, keep peeling a layer of gloves off as you go;
- applied a liberal amount of fresh marine Sikaflex 291 (black looks best, don't get the white) inside the collar and over the mast collar substrate;
- slid the collar up the mast into place. Don't worry if some of the Sikaflex gets left behind lower down the mast, that's why you used lots of masking tape - you just want to be sure that you've got as much Sikaflex pre-packed in the slots and grooves as you can, a little bit of waste is a small price for good adhesion;
- pushed additional Sikaflex up under the lower rim of collar (you can use some of the stuff off the masking tape that you left lower down the mast);
- cleaned up excess sikaflex with a rag / paper towels, and left a careful reinforcing taper rim of Sikaflex above and below the top and bottom rims of the collar (I used the straight edge of a credit card, although you could probably also use the blunt edge of a gloved finger);
- leave the Sikaflex to just start to set;
- carefully remove the masking tape alongside the taper rims of Sikaflex, and off the outside of the Collar (if you leave it too long, you might end up tearing the masking tape leaving a layer buried under the Sikaflex);
- remove the rest of the masking tape the next day;
- leave the mast in a damp spot for at least a week or more for the Sikaflex to cure (cure relies on moisture/humidity, if you're enjoying a dry summer, wrap in a a damp paper towel and plastic and leave in a sunny spot);
- tap the mast plug back in with a block of wood, not a plain hammer;
- drill a new hole in the plastic plug, through the existing hole in the mast base (remember, Selden warranty void if user drills additional holes in their mast, I believe.  Don't even try to line up the old hole in the plastic plug, if you succeed 100% you need to buy a lottery ticket);
- fix new rivet to retain the mast plug (after all that tapping, you might not think it can move again, but yes it can, that's why the rivet is there in the first place).

When sailing, lubricate your collar and mast step, and make sure you don't get grit / dirt between the surfaces otherwise you're going to grind something away eventually, and if there's too much grit, somethings gotta give (better the Sikaflex in the collar than the mast step in the boat, but you've now done quite a bit to ensure the Sikaflex joint won't fail).

Happy Sailing!
Cheers, 
Ron  



Reply
18/07/2020 14:56:00
RonF 'Delphine'
Posts: 28
And this is the collar after I cleaned it, keyed and roughed it up (details in next reply):



Reply
18/07/2020 13:52:00
RonF 'Delphine'
Posts: 28
This is Collar after I first removed it, note that it is relatively smooth inside apart from the pre-formed longitudinal grooves:




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18/07/2020 13:49:00
RonF 'Delphine'
Posts: 28
This is collar after repair:


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18/07/2020 13:45:00
RonF 'Delphine'
Posts: 28
Hi Mark, this is what my collar looked like before repair:
 



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18/07/2020 13:39:00
RonF 'Delphine'
Posts: 28
Can anyone post an image of a correct collar and describe the defect, or a defective collar describing what it should look like, please? (My hull/mast is less than a year old, but all the rubber has worn away and looks like the carbon is grinding away against the upper rim of the 'socket'- but not sure if this is normal wear and tear...)


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14/07/2020 17:10:00
Mark Ripley
Posts: 5
I Literally found the same issue last week on mine. Only 18 months old. As you say a kit is available and waiting for it to arrive to see how to do it so glad you posted the issues . Thanks


Reply
14/07/2020 15:44:00
Stepher
Posts: 12
Hi, I have the same problem with the mast collar riding up. 
What glue / sealer is recommended for  re-fixing it ?



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13/07/2020 16:05:00
Nick H
Posts: 3
Thanks Gareth, that sounds like a very good (best?) solution, and certainly the one I'll use next time, assuming the collar itself isn't damaged. Is this a common issue? I'll certainly be checking it after every sail from now on.
Thanks again for your reply.
Malcolm
PS isn't it great to be back on the water - maybe we'll get to race sometime soon!



Reply
25/06/2020 10:44:00
malcamp
Posts: 5
I tried that, but it just has the effect of 'camming' it tighter - you need to be able to impact it all round the circumference at the same time. I was also worried about potential damage to the mast itself.
 



Reply
25/06/2020 10:37:00
malcamp
Posts: 5
malcamp,
For removing the base, the flange on the base is slightly wider than the mast and can be tapped with something thin but blunt, like a hammer against a large fat headed screw driver.
 
The screw/rivet holding the mast base in to the mast is important, without it the mast base can eventually work lose despite the good 'interference fit' . It could then fall out before or during stepping the mast leading to bad things happening. It was added after the first few months of production with a retro fit kit sent to the early owners. (Credited as 'the Ffinlo Fix').



Reply
25/06/2020 10:08:00
Peter Barton
Posts: 4676
Most people just re-glue the existing collar into the mast.
 



Reply
24/06/2020 11:29:00
Gareth
Posts: 170
After one season of sailing (maybe just 30 days, but mostly in high winds), I discovered when taking my Aero out of its winter wraps a week or so ago, that the mast collar had come loose. No idea exactly when this had happened as it's not something I'd check regularly (mast is left in place on the dinghy berth during the season). RS have a replacement 'kit' which I bought (about £30), and which includes everything (?) you need to replace/re-fix it. All well and good, I thought. In order to fit/remove a mast collar, you first have to remove the mast foot plug which may be secured by either a single rivet, or a self-tapping screw (the kit contains replacements for both). In my case, it was a rivet, so that had to be drilled out which I did carefully, using progressively bigger drill bits. OK, so now I just pull it out! Ha Ha. The instructions in the kit suggest "If it needs encouragement, a long robust item can be inserted into the mast and the plug tapped out". Well, if the 'plug' was an actual plug, and you had a rigid pole longer the mast section, then this might be possible. However, the 'plug' is basically a 5cm long hard plastic/nylon cylinder with walls about 5mm thick with a flange to protect the bottom of the mast and the hull, which has been tapped/hammered in to give what I would describe in engineering terms as an 'interference fit'. (Not sure why it needs a rivet to hold it in place!) So unless your 'long robust item' has a solid end piece close to the internal diameter of the mast section, there's no way you can tap it out. Having tried everything I could think of to shift it, I eventually hacksawed off a bit if the flange and then carefully drilled close parallel holes down the length of the plug walls until it collapsed sufficiently to make it possible to grab a protruding bit of the hacksawed flange with a mole-wrench and pull it out. The notes say "We have supplied a replacement so it doesn't matter if the heel plug is damaged" Ha Ha. So the moral of this story is:
1. Check your mast collar regularly
2. Don't expect it's going to be an easy job to replace/repair it. 
Maybe RS could provide a tool in the form of a suitable long robust item?! 



Reply
23/06/2020 15:36:00
malcamp
Posts: 5


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